The Use of Tamil in Carnatic Music Concerts in London and Other Thoughts
All students of music are exhorted to listen to as much music as possible, of the style they are learning. Given that London doesn’t have as many Carnatic music concerts as I would have been able to listen to in India, I make an extra effort to go when there is one, even if the concert isn’t at an easily reachable venue. They are often on Sundays when public transport in London breaks down.
Recently there was a concert at a temple hall, of an artist who was visiting from India and I had to take a train and then a bus to reach the temple. I waited and waited at the bus stop, but characteristic of Sunday behaviour, the bus didn’t arrive. There was this nice Tamil speaking couple at the stop and they told me they’d been waiting for the bus for at least half an hour before I arrived. As it turned out they wanted to go to the same temple and knew of an alternate route. So with their help I took another bus and we walked the rest of the way. Since it was dark and lonely, I was grateful they were around. They kept talking to each other in Tamil and when talking to me switched to English. Finally they asked me if I spoke Tamil. I said no, otherwise I would have spoken to them in Tamil! I was surprised that they would think I would carry on in English, if I knew Tamil.
At the temple, I managed to figure out where the concert was, but there was not a soul in sight. I went to the main temple and sat there, as there were many more people there, said my prayers and then asked at the reception about the concert. An elderly gentleman and lady were there and they appeared rather annoyed. I said, I’m sorry I don’t speak Tamil, I can’t read any of the signs, and they visibly thawed and told me when the concert was expected to start, smiled and were helpful.
Concert begins. Opening speech in Tamil, singer speaks and introduces the music in Tamil and the concluding speech is in Tamil, in which the two words I kept hearing were sampradaya (which I understood) and avargal.
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I often read or hear Carnatic musicians saying that Hindustani music is better appreciated in the West. What I have observed in London (the scene may be different in places like Amsterdam) is that big name Hindustani instrumentalists like Ravi Shankar and Amjad Ali Khan draw crowds that include non-Indians, and they perform in the bigger more well known theatres. Vocalists are less well appreciated. And Dhrupad is popular amongst a niche, non-Indian audience. Otherwise one has to go to the Bharatiya Vidya Bhavan or the Nehru Centre.
Often, at concerts, Carnatic vocalists speak in Tamil, or largely in Tamil. Now I understand that Tamilians want to speak in Tamil. It is a beautiful language, one should be proud of it and one should speak it. But when one is addressing an audience of music lovers/students/listeners one has to assume there will be Indians and non-Indians there who will not understand Tamil but are trying to find out more about the music. There are people here who are trying to relate to both Hindustani and Carnatic vocal music. We already have to contend with the fact that concerts are badly advertised, that people who are not familiar with Bharatiya Vidya Bhavan etc will never know when there is a concert on, that they are often few and far between or sometimes in far flung places. These concerts have to be made more accessible, in more ways than one.
U,
There are many sides to this issue. Consider this, There was this one concert a few years where the artiste being honored was a frail old lady who did not speak or follow English.And the chief guest and another subsequent speaker who honored her spoke all the way in English..Sure the audience followed etc but I somehow thought the people missed the point of ‘honoring’ someone. Sometimes I think carnatic music is stuck in its language trappings a lot more than its North Indian counterpart. Hence after what perhaps was a musically wonderful concert one hears complaints like ‘No tamil songs (substitute other south indian language here)’. Another case, what would/should the language of choice be if the organization who organizes is a language/region-based organization.Should they then not speak the language which is the very basis of the organization’s existence etc .. But your argument is valid in depending on who organized the concert. So I am not sure if there’s a one-size fits all organizations answer but English flyers introducing artistes is one way of dealing with the issue.
That is really sad. What’s the point of honouring someone if they can’t understand you! I agree, there is no one size fits all and the context should be taken into account. That’s why I restricted myself to London. I agree, Carnatic music is stuck in language trappings a lot more…and have heard the “no Tamil song” complaint. But nowadays there are whole concerts in Tamil, no?
Yes, Hindustani is more popular in the west, compared to Carnatic, but it should be – given George Harrison in the height of Beatlemania, circa 1966, took Ravi Shankar as his teacher. Carnatic suffers from lack of such high profile popularization, not because of the cosmetic things around how concerts are organized. The niche crowd that shows up for Carnatic concerts in the west (particularly here in US, where I am posting from) will show up even if T.N. Seshagoplan gets introduced in Swahili. May be I am speaking out blithe ignorance and if so, please smack me down.
There are some cosmetic things that do matter. For instance, many British people don’t know about the existence of Bharatiya Vidya Bhavan and that there are concerts held there. A lot of people I know, when they come into contact with Carnatic music, purely by chance, enjoy it and want to listen to more and learn more. So apart from the niche crowds an effort does have to be made to get the non niche ones as well, for both Hindustani and Carnatic vocal. Of course if TNS sang here and was introduced in Swahili, I would go! You guys are lucky in the US, you seem to be having a lot of concerts!
Translation may be time consuming, but it would certainly help!
There needn’t be a full translation, but some brief intros etc in English would help.
Sometimes I feel like language is considered to be irrelevant in Carnatic music. Not for everyone, but given that a large number of students and promoters are Tamil, and mostly mug up Telugu kritis, they barely understand what exactly it is that they are singing. Which explains why there is so much horrendous pronunciation.
Sure there are people trying to revive the lesser celebrated Tamil pieces, but given the approach of mathematical precision for appreciating, I always got the feeling that during the speeches, all the people basically went out and got themselves vadais and bondas.
Without Tamil promoters Carnatic music would not be in the healthy condition it is in today.
. The vadais and bondas deserve a separate post. Sometimes they are only for the artistes, when they are available to everyone there are huge crowds thronging the place (not the organisers fault as they have to work with a limited space)…
There were no vadais and bondas at this concert
I have heard complaints that even Tamil pieces are being mugged and not really understood. And the audiences here are too well behaved to walk out during speeches
U,
I think this might be a London phenomenon – from my experience, while carnatic-music lovers in the US tend to be overwhelmingly from one of the southern states, most concerts here do have the concert flyer in English, and the artists are introduced in English. Among artists, the older generation typically speaks in Tamil (even non-Tamilian artists like KSG), while the younger generation seem to prefer English.
Haven’t seen any demands for Tamil-only concerts here (I worked for the local carnatic music org in a couple of states and we still go to as many concerts as we can get to), though in the cases of concerts organized by the local state associaions, like the Tamil sangams or the Kannada kootas, the artistes themselves seem to select songs from those states. (like M.S. Sheela- she chooses a lot of Kannada songs). What I have noted is that the concert formats tend to be very traditional here – no skipping the RTP, at least one ghana raagam etc. Some of the younger artistes have confessed that they find audiences in the US a lot more critical than the ones in India, and that they prepare more for these concerts!
M
Flyers are in English, where they do exist, but not widely distributed amongst the non-Indian audience…we have to find a way of letting non-niche audiences know when there are concerts. Really envy you people in the US and your rich music scene. As for Tamil only (or Kannada only)concerts, have heard that happen in India, not here. Why don’t you come here and organise some concerts?!
MG,
I think the carnatic music scene has gone downhill a bit now in London – we know some artistes, through having hosted them here on their tours, and they mentioned that there are fewer tours in the UK, which seems to prefer “light music” – interestingly, Europe seems to be gaining popularity. I have cousins in London, who’ve lived there all their lives and they tell me the same thing – they used to host artistes regularly, but now it has been a while since anyone came to London.
As for letting non-niche audiences know about concerts – not sure what the orgs in UK do, but here, most do the best they can. Most are non-profits, operating on fairly tight budgets – an ad large enough to be seen by the general public, in a popular newspaper (as an example – we tried this for one dance performance where we needed the attendance to raise money) costs a lot. The one thing we always do is to look up any indic organization in the city we’re in, and see if they have a web page – most do – and then look for events sponsored by that org. Many of the larger US cities also have desi-centric forums (similar to Sulekha), and notices of concerts are posted there. Notices are also posted in the temple(s) and sent out as part of the temple newsletter. One of our local universities has a school of music, where Indian music is a subject – we send out flyers of concerts to that school.
Recently, we’ve seen that kutcheribuzz.com promote concerts around the world.
I think the UK also suffers from the phenomenon of Indian artistes thinking all of the UK is one city, so a concert is Manchester is the same as a London concert!
M
Glad that I’m not the only one feeling this way and that I’m not imagining it.There was one year when we had a run of good concerts, Hindustani and Carnatic, and then they dried up.
@ U
Interesting timing (for me to have read this post).
One because Neha assures me that on the Dec 7th concert, we have seats near you
Yes. You can’t escape me
. But at that concert I think they will speak in English. Otherwise we have Neha and R to translate!
Secondly because I am the trustee of a not-for-profit foundation in early stages of development which aims at creating communal harmony through the arts and culture. In discussions with one of the founders this week, I mentioned how un-diverse some of the ‘networks’ I went to, as part of my work, were. She said that Hindustani music and classical dance communities were very diverse. They (her husband, the multi instrument playing musician and she, Indian classical dancer and vocalist) always communicate in English with their audiences in the Middle East, South Africa, Europe and of course the UK. I will mention this post to her as diversity in many forms is core to our aims and work. In brief, I empathise fully with your experience (As a side note: we are looking for friends and patrons at the moment, and I am happy to talk more about it if you would like to be involved, thanks).
How interesting. Do mail me more details…Would love to be involved, though am too broke to be a patron! I have to say though, that some Hindustani musicians can also be pretty “un-diverse” in they way they sometimes dismiss Carnatic music…with a foot in both worlds now, am beginning to see the problems with attitudes in both!
PS: How hard is it to print and photocopy handouts? May be charge a couple quid for it? They do that at the Opera, don’t they?
To be fair, at the bigger concerts they do have flyers, but it isn’t consistent. Usually these don’t convey much information, they’re mostly ads for the concerts. The London scene isn’t as lively as in the US at the moment, but I think this is at least partly, the fault of the audience.
U:
I can tell you more when we meet if you like or I can clog your mailbox. Whichever you prefer. The musician is Indian and blind; his wife is of Russian Jewish descent and they have been married over 25 years. Diversity becomes them, doesn’t it?
And at this stage, we need friends who can introduce us to PR people and to possible donors etc. I am making pitches to some £££££ people and some of them we meet this weekend over tea and cakes. I have a lot of corp venturing experience but not-for-profit is a different ballgame altogether.
See you in a few days.
Ok, let’s talk when we meet though I don’t mind the clogged inbox…! Yes, diversity does become them!
I thought I was imagining the decline of Carnatic music concerts in London – glad other people have noticed it. I thought maybe I didn’t have the right contacts or something.
Also, the last few concerts that I have been to have been a little disappointing – very little classical music and too many Tamil thukkadas.
I try to go to Chennai every two years in December but it’s getting rather frustrating to see virtually no other concerts in between.
Speaking to some friends/cousins in US, Canada and Australia this doesn’t seem to be the case there.
No it’s not the case in the places you’ve mentioned, and I am dying of jealousy!
Having been bemoaning the lack on concerts in London recently, I just noticed that there are a few coming up:
TM Krishna is singing in Rickmansworth on March 28 (www.avarthanas.org)
Aruna Sairam is singing at Southbank centre on 3rd April
Shashank / Ganesh Kumaresh violin concert at southbank centre on 4th April
Sanjay Subrahmaniam is singing on May 19th at Bhavan (vanifinearts.net)
If anyone knows of any other concerts coming up please reply as I find it quite hard to find out about them.